Tsugaru Nishiki

[Sabine]

Full moon tonight? I guess my little guys couldn't wait. They spawned this morning.
I only have 1 female (with a crooked mouth :() and 4 males.
I'll see what will come out of it. None of the parent fish is as good as I wish, but if only one or two little fish were decent ones I'd be more than happy.

[afnaveils]

Congrats! Great news Sabine.

[afnaveils]

Hi Sabine,

How many fry did you get from your Tsugaru Nishiki?

[Sabine]

Gerard, they have just started hatching this morning. About 35 I can see already clinging to the glass, in a planted tank.
So up went the brine shrimp bottle!

[Sabine]

Photos of parents and fry:
http://www.personainternet.com/sabine/tsugaru/nishiki.html

[Sabine]

We are up to 221 fry, and there will still be some more stragglers.
Since they didn't spawn where they were supposed to, Guenther has been busy transferring them one by one.
I am surprised that there are so many, considering that it was a very small female, not even a year old. She is barely 2" without caudal fin.

[Sabine]

5 days after hatching:
http://www.personainternet.com/sabine/temp/5days.jpg
The parents spawned again yesterday.

[afnaveils]

Hi Sabine,

You mentioned that the female parent has a mouth deformation. Is there any fry which shows this defect? Or, are they too small to tell yet?

Gerard

[Sabine]

They are still too small to see that. And too many to put under the microscope to check. The mother has one corner of the mouth folded inward.
I do see lots of spikes and dorsals - the oranda ancestor is not too far away, I guess.
I had almost no spikes among my ranchu fry. How about your BEP?

[afnaveils]

My BEP fry are doing great! I didn't have a big spawn, about 60 fry swimming and eating well. I have not put them in a tank yet and so, I don't know how they look sideways. They are F1. My first F1 group, now 2 years old, are all females. So, I'm in a precarious position of having only one mature male.

My Naitoh ranchu fry are also doing great. I've got about 100 fry. 3 to 4 died since they start eating I culled about 15 which remained at the bottom, although they were eating.

Pictures will come soon.

[Sabine]

So far I have culled 100 spiked fry. One of the males has a knobby on the back, maybe he is the culprit.
I took out a plant after the 2nd spawning a week later and figured there can't be more than 5 eggs. There were another 70 fry!
So there were a total of 300 fry, 30% now culled. But there are not 200 left, I guess the bottom sitters just perished.
I'll see... as long as there is one nice pair among the offspring it will all be worth it.
Yesterday they were chasing again - seems like a prolific bunch.

[Sabine]

The difference 1 week makes: the first and 2nd spawn, 1 and 2 weeks old, respectively.
http://www.personainternet.com/sabine/temp/1and2weekold.jpg

[afnaveils]

Tsugaru fry looking great, Sabine!! It's really encouraging when the bellies start to show.

[Sabine]

A little older now, 18 days.
I see largely differing tails now, most are very beautiful, but others look squarish and am not sure about culling or not. I'll try to get a photo of those in question later.
http://www.personainternet.com/sabine/tsugaru/images/tsugaru_nishiki_18_days_old.jpg

[afnaveils]

Great picture Sabine! My BEP seem to be growing at the same rate as your Tsugarus.

[Sabine]

They are starting to look like little fish now. The colour surprises me, shouldn't they be turning dark now at 1 month old? http://www.personainternet.com/sabine/tsugaru/images/1month_old2.jpg

[Sabine]

Update: they are 6 1/2 weeks old now:
http://www.personainternet.com/sabine/tsugaru/images/long_fin_ranchu.jpg
I have a dozen left, 2 of them smaller ones from the 2nd spawn.

[harzan]

I must say, you really are very disciplined in your culling...I would keep the junk too long. I look forward to seeing th progress as the tails grow out.

Harris

[Sabine]

I'm ruthless out of necessity. So far they grew up in a 5 gallon tank (no comment please), they just were transferred yesterday into a 29 gallon tank (now the wakin fry need the 5 gallon).
Besides, I know only of one store, more than 200km away, that would be willing, reluctantly, to take any fish. They tried, but the ranchu didn't sell well, in fact, some of them
are still in the store after almost 2 years (and they are not fish with flaws, crooked or anything).
So if I don't want to cull big fish a year down the road I got to do it now.
I think I know now why the parents all had kinked caudal fins. In the larger tank 2 of the fry had a few kinked finrays within 2 hours of being exposed to a stronger filter current. Seems like these tails are a lot more sensitive than ranchu tails.
I wonder if that's also the case with the blue egg phoenix?

[afnaveils]

Sabine,

Great Tsugarus! I wish I could cull like you but BEPs being so rare, I tend to keep most of them. Fortunately, my spawns are small.

Concerning kinked finrays, I`ve not noticed this phenomenon on my BEPs. For the first 2 weeks, my eggs/fry are in a kitchen basin with only a low stream of air from a sandstone. Then, I put them in a 20 gallon tank with a mini aquaclear filter with a filter sponge on the intake tube, water low enough to maintain a low discharge. Later in a 30 gallon tank, but always with low filtration intake and discharge. So not much current most of the time and regular water changes.

However, the main defect on my BEPs is mostly crooked tail fin or undivided tailfins. Some fry get bumpy backline, none with spikes. Most have smooth and, from close to straight to slight curved backlines.

[Sabine]

Gerard, my tsugarus and your egg phoenix would complement each other: beautiful tails from my tsugarus and smooth backs from your egg phoenix :)

[afnaveils]

Yes Sabine. We'll have to think of how we could swap fry or fish someday.

[harzan]

Sabine,

at what size do your fry show the longer tails?

Thanks,

Harris

[Sabine]

Harris, they showed tails different from ranchus at already about 2cm long. Probably even earlier. I think even the little fry in the photo with the coin shows a different tail from ranchu.
Most are about 3cm long now, some even longer.
I'm very happy with how they turn out.

[Sabine]

Update, they are 3 1/2 months old now. Here with the parent fish - the "dust" is pollen in the water:

http://www.personainternet.com/sabine/tsugaru/images/tubfish.jpg
5.3cm long (2 1/4"):
http://www.personainternet.com/sabine/tsugaru/images/tsugaru_nishiki_53cm.jpg

[Tedster]

Great job! They look good!

Cheers!

TT

[thomasn]

Great Job!

[marlin08]

Wow!!
Just beautiful....

[harzan]

Hey Sabine,

I was thinking that if your fish do not turn color until they are a few years old, maybe they came from a calico. Gunther bred a calico (mostly orange) to a black or greenish blue and got wonderful blues...

[Sabine]

That is my suspicion too - these fish are supposed to stay dark for about 4 years, so I believe they must come from calico lines.
I have a sakura ranchu female and would love to cross her to one of the tsugaru males, but unfortunately she just doesn't spawn. She is 2 years old and has never spawned.
Yes, I know Guenther's fish, that's exactly what I'm aiming for.

[harzan]

I am sure you will have other fish by 5 years, but I know of someone who had fish spawn this year for the first time and are 5 years old, atleast.

I would love to see if this is a repeat of Gunther's